Dedicated to my Lord Jesus Christ in thanks for His infinite mercy
Monday, May 28, 2012
Father Steven Scheier's Judgment Experience
I first watched this show on EWTN many years ago and it affects me today just as powerfully as it did back then. It explains my recent posts far better than I could ever do.
I've listened to the video. At the end the priest makes my point. He mentions the "pleasure" of sin; which makes us not want to stop committing it.
Now ... I don't want to take over this post and start another discussion.
God made us. He knows our weaknesses. He knows that certain sins cause us "pleasure"; whether it's drink, gluttony, cheating or whatever. Some are serious mortals and should stop. Others ... well, forgiveable venials which are part of our fallen nature.
Will God really frown and hit us on the head if we continue committing the "pleasurable" venials and have no intention of stopping?
After all ... a good lawyer would say: "But God, you made me this way. If you had not given me that particular weakness I would not have continued to commit the repeat venial sin."
I saw this when it first aired and was very impressed. Father Sheier is now back in his home diocese last I heard, working as a pastor. I bet going to confession to him is a great experience. There's nothing like being snatched from the jaws of hell to sober somebody up and inject a lot of wisdom.
Victor, It's a powerful video. Fr. said that he had it planned that when he got before the judgment seat he could excuse himself, "But lord, she pushed me that day and that's why I did what I did." Or, "But Lord, I had a bad day, I didn't feel too good." That, and these parts stood out for me:
"None of it mattered because when you are talking to truth you can't give excuses."
"They are the only real things that exist. We are the ones in the shadow world. We have 1 home and it's not here."
He also said that it doesn't matter what people think, only what God thinks. He felt sorrow for his sins but the wrong kind of sorrow and used Confession as "fire insurance". And that he wouldn't listen because of the pleasure he was experiencing and "it wasn't about to be taken away from me".
Sure, mortal sins are worst but we have to ask God for the grace to rid ourselves of deliberate venial sins and when we go to Confession we need a firm purpose of amendment. Of course, everyone falls and commits venial sin but are they deliberate? And if they are: Are we truly sorry for them? Falling into sin through weakness isn't the same as committing deliberate venial sins. When they are deliberate, we think about them first and still decide to do them. Though they may not be grave matter they can lead to bigger sins. Little falls from weaknesses don't fall under this category. Everyone would be in hell if this were the case. According to the Church only mortal sin leaves us not in a state of grace. The problem with deliberate venial sins is that they weaken us and can lead to mortal sin (which is what happened to me when I was young).
I'm guessing you are talking about the little falls? Well, I guess the question is simply, "Are we sorry for them?" usually the answer is yes even if we commit them often.
Theresa, Isn't it though? Every person in the audience hung on his every word. I loved this show. It was one of my favorites and I still get shivers when I watch it.
Mary, Thanks for sharing this; I had not seen the original airing of it. What stood out for me was his recounting the intercession of Our Lady. It made me think of something I read in Fr. Joseph Homick's book on Mary (one I highly recommend.) He had a very powerful experience with Our Lady where he heard her tell him that he (we) do not realize how much she has saved us from (I'm paraphrasing).And I believe Fr. is right-God will refuse her nothing! As for sin, well yeah it is pleasurable-Satan counts on that along with our weakness. I guess bottom line is: deliberate sin(mortal or venial) means we love ourselves more than God. Father mentioned having our priorities straight- if we put God first and confess when we don't, all else will fall into place. Sorry for going on so long; there is a lot to Father's witness to think about.
Karin, I loved that part too! We are blessed to have her as an intercessor for us! I've never read the book you mentioned - thanks for the recommendation.
Great comment on sin. Yes, it means we are putting ourselves before God. We act like little gods and don't give God first place in our lives. (Which is odd because He is our entire life and there is no existence without Him. That fallen nature again!)
That was a great point Kerinann made. It is the *putting God first* and when we don't, we need to confess. That is great way to make an examination of conscience in a new light.
For example...choosing going on the computer instead of praying some of the rosary or quiet time with the Lord...oiy!
Hi Mary, going really well. I took a month of blogging to pray about social networks and where God wanted me posting. Now back into it and hoping to be able to keep up with my favourite blogs a bit more.
I also love Mother Angelica. I first was introduced to her back in the mid 70's. What a fire-cracker. Mary, it is awful nice of you to share these posts of testimonies. Blessings and hugs.
Hi Grace, Firecracker is a good word for her! She's always made me laugh and I've always loved her personality. She's real and I like that. Blessings and hugs to you too, my friend!
Hi Ros, The whole world needs to watch this video. No doubt many will think it only applies to those of us who attend the OF ;) Sorry, couldn't resist tossing that in!
Mary, I know this was a while ago, but I was just able to watch it two days ago (most of it.)
Concern #1: apparently his damnation wouldn't have been for mortal sins...? Doesn't that fly in the face of everything we've been taught? Just a whole lot of venial sins?
Concern #2: He didn't really talk about "what changed" afterward. He wasn't specific about the things he did differently after having this experience. How is it different to be a priest "for Christ" rather than a priest "for oneself"?
Contrast his experience of judgment to that woman from South America, who got hit by lightning. The stories are nearly identical in many ways (she was saved because of the prayers of a man who saw her story in the newspaper, e.g., and her experience of hearing her sins was very similar. There was no defense. Jesus was very organized about how He catalogued her sins, though.)
In that woman's story (it's here: http://www.unitypublishing.com/Moral/gloriapolo.htm she lists her sins out for us, tells us exactly what they were, and then how she attempted to make amends afterward.
I guess that's what I felt was different about Fr. Scheier's testimony. The vagueness was difficult to connect with, and the fact that it really does sound like his damning sin was self-absorption rather than, say, murder or theft or adultery or even missing Mass. You know?
I'm not saying it's not legit, but it's concerning.
Jane, I was left with some questions after watching this show too. I am assuming his "damnation" would have been for mortal sins, right? It doesn't say on this clip but I could have sworn on the original show that he said it was serious sin that condemned him - this was after the testimony he gave but it's not on this clip. I was thinking that part of it was cut out, maybe?
I think it changed him greatly. He became an intercessor for others whereas before he said his only concern was for himself and what his peers thought of him.
Thanks for the link! I'll go check out the story...you've got me curious.
Thanks, Mary. I went back and you're right, he does say he was in a state of mortal sin and didn't care about it.
I guess what I was waiting for was something more like, "Now when my parishioners call me at three in the morning to visit the dying, I don't grumble about it, I just see it as a way of being Christ to the ones who need Him..." etc etc. But I'm being picky here. He was vague about the "after" part and specific changes he made, but he does say he increased his prayer life.
Wow, I hadn't seen this before. Very powerful. Felt something heavy in the middle of my chest while watching this. I knew exactly what she meant when she said, "I almost hate to go to calls." Here is a man who has appeared before the judgment seat of Christ, and experienced the loving intercession of the Blessed Mother. I wanted Mother Angelica to ask him more! I read the Gloria Polo (doesn't pollo mean Chicken?) testimony today too. It does make me wonder. The only thing anyone has is to be made clean in the Precious Blood of the Lamb. If we die in that knowledge and plead for his Divine Mercy, even if we are between good confessions and "valid" absolutions (due to firm purpose of amendment being present)wouldn't pleading for this be enough, or would it really require the pleading of Mary, and the pleading of others of her children and Christ's followers? Makes me wonder. Maybe it is Mary's pleading with her spouse the Holy Spirit that had all these Christians, whether Catholic or not, praying for this Father Scheier and for the peasant half-way across Colombia praying for Gloria. The Communion of Saints is real, and there is some power for sure in prayer. I remember Jesus telling St. Faustina to pray the chaplet after he took her to the bed of a dying sinner being beseiged by demons. He wanted to save the man, had the power to save him, but he needed her prayers too. What a mystery?
Mother Angelica is such a wonder. How adept she was to pick up on the unspoken confusion that was apparent to her, but not to Fr. Scheier on why mortal sin might still be there on the soul even after frequenting Confession. Contrition can be imperfect...sorrow because of fear of punishment rather than because of the offense of having offended Our Lord and added to his pain in his Passion and death, but firm purpose of amendment needs to be there regardless of imperfect contrition. That definitely gives me pause. And she ended perfectly...you read your car's owners manual (at least some refer to it on occasion) study what sin is . . . what the 10 Commandments are . . . Too bad they couldn't have used some executive programming direction to extend this episode another hour. She was on a roll.
Thanx Mary. I had not seen this.
ReplyDeleteGod bless.
Oh...I sooo remember this clip...so powerful. I am watching it again.
ReplyDeleteBlessings~Theresa
Mary,
ReplyDeleteI've listened to the video. At the end the priest makes my point. He mentions the "pleasure" of sin; which makes us not want to stop committing it.
Now ... I don't want to take over this post and start another discussion.
God made us. He knows our weaknesses. He knows that certain sins cause us "pleasure"; whether it's drink, gluttony, cheating or whatever. Some are serious mortals and should stop. Others ... well, forgiveable venials which are part of our fallen nature.
Will God really frown and hit us on the head if we continue committing the "pleasurable" venials and have no intention of stopping?
After all ... a good lawyer would say: "But God, you made me this way. If you had not given me that particular weakness I would not have continued to commit the repeat venial sin."
God bless.
I saw this when it first aired and was very impressed. Father Sheier is now back in his home diocese last I heard, working as a pastor. I bet going to confession to him is a great experience. There's nothing like being snatched from the jaws of hell to sober somebody up and inject a lot of wisdom.
ReplyDeleteVictor,
ReplyDeleteIt's a powerful video. Fr. said that he had it planned that when he got before the judgment seat he could excuse himself, "But lord, she pushed me that day and that's why I did what I did." Or, "But Lord, I had a bad day, I didn't feel too good." That, and these parts stood out for me:
"None of it mattered because when you are talking to truth you can't give excuses."
"They are the only real things that exist. We are the ones in the shadow world. We have 1 home and it's not here."
He also said that it doesn't matter what people think, only what God thinks. He felt sorrow for his sins but the wrong kind of sorrow and used Confession as "fire insurance". And that he wouldn't listen because of the pleasure he was experiencing and "it wasn't about to be taken away from me".
Sure, mortal sins are worst but we have to ask God for the grace to rid ourselves of deliberate venial sins and when we go to Confession we need a firm purpose of amendment. Of course, everyone falls and commits venial sin but are they deliberate? And if they are:
Are we truly sorry for them? Falling into sin through weakness isn't the same as committing deliberate venial sins. When they are deliberate, we think about them first and still decide to do them. Though they may not be grave matter they can lead to bigger sins. Little falls from weaknesses don't fall under this category. Everyone would be in hell if this were the case. According to the Church only mortal sin leaves us not in a state of grace. The problem with deliberate venial sins is that they weaken us and can lead to mortal sin (which is what happened to me when I was young).
I'm guessing you are talking about the little falls? Well, I guess the question is simply, "Are we sorry for them?" usually the answer is yes even if we commit them often.
Thanks for watching the video, Victor :)
Theresa,
ReplyDeleteIsn't it though? Every person in the audience hung on his every word. I loved this show. It was one of my favorites and I still get shivers when I watch it.
Barb,
ReplyDeleteSnatched from the jaws of hell is a great way of expressing it. I loved the comment you left on Victor's post, by the way. It was very helpful.
Mary,
ReplyDeleteThanks for sharing this; I had not seen the original airing of it. What stood out for me was his recounting the intercession of Our Lady. It made me think of something I read in Fr. Joseph Homick's book on Mary (one I highly recommend.) He had a very powerful experience with Our Lady where he heard her tell him that he (we) do not realize how much she has saved us from (I'm paraphrasing).And I believe Fr. is right-God will refuse her nothing!
As for sin, well yeah it is pleasurable-Satan counts on that along with our weakness. I guess bottom line is: deliberate sin(mortal or venial) means we love ourselves more than God. Father mentioned having our priorities straight- if we put God first and confess when we don't, all else will fall into place. Sorry for going on so long; there is a lot to Father's witness to think about.
Karin,
ReplyDeleteI loved that part too! We are blessed to have her as an intercessor for us! I've never read the book you mentioned - thanks for the recommendation.
Great comment on sin. Yes, it means we are putting ourselves before God. We act like little gods and don't give God first place in our lives. (Which is odd because He is our entire life and there is no existence without Him. That fallen nature again!)
God bless!
That was a great point Kerinann made. It is the *putting God first* and when we don't, we need to confess. That is great way to make an examination of conscience in a new light.
ReplyDeleteFor example...choosing going on the computer instead of praying some of the rosary or quiet time with the Lord...oiy!
Theresa,
ReplyDeleteDefinitely a good way to examine our conscience!
Yup, exactly like choosing to go on the computer instead of the Rosary or quiet time with the Lord ;)
PS (This is my "false self" typing these keys. Lol.)
hubby and I have seen this priest a couple of times on EWTN. It is a powerful testimony. Thanks so much for sharing it Mary.
ReplyDeleteHi Therese,
ReplyDeleteHow are you? I've seen it a couple of times too. What a story!
Hi Mary, going really well. I took a month of blogging to pray about social networks and where God wanted me posting. Now back into it and hoping to be able to keep up with my favourite blogs a bit more.
ReplyDeleteI also love Mother Angelica. I first was introduced to her back in the mid 70's. What a fire-cracker. Mary, it is awful nice of you to share these posts of testimonies. Blessings and hugs.
ReplyDeleteHi Therese,
ReplyDeleteI'm glad you are doing well! May God bless you and your family!
Hi Grace,
ReplyDeleteFirecracker is a good word for her! She's always made me laugh and I've always loved her personality. She's real and I like that. Blessings and hugs to you too, my friend!
Amazing, Powerful Near Death Experience!
ReplyDeleteThanks for Sharing.
Hi Madeleine,
ReplyDeleteI've never been able to forget this show. It's a powerful example of God's love and mercy and shows how much Our Lady loves us too.
I have posted this once but may again later this week. As you say, it is powerful!
ReplyDeleteHi Ros,
ReplyDeleteThe whole world needs to watch this video. No doubt many will think it only applies to those of us who attend the OF ;) Sorry, couldn't resist tossing that in!
Mary, I know this was a while ago, but I was just able to watch it two days ago (most of it.)
ReplyDeleteConcern #1: apparently his damnation wouldn't have been for mortal sins...? Doesn't that fly in the face of everything we've been taught? Just a whole lot of venial sins?
Concern #2: He didn't really talk about "what changed" afterward. He wasn't specific about the things he did differently after having this experience. How is it different to be a priest "for Christ" rather than a priest "for oneself"?
Contrast his experience of judgment to that woman from South America, who got hit by lightning. The stories are nearly identical in many ways (she was saved because of the prayers of a man who saw her story in the newspaper, e.g., and her experience of hearing her sins was very similar. There was no defense. Jesus was very organized about how He catalogued her sins, though.)
In that woman's story (it's here:
http://www.unitypublishing.com/Moral/gloriapolo.htm
she lists her sins out for us, tells us exactly what they were, and then how she attempted to make amends afterward.
I guess that's what I felt was different about Fr. Scheier's testimony. The vagueness was difficult to connect with, and the fact that it really does sound like his damning sin was self-absorption rather than, say, murder or theft or adultery or even missing Mass. You know?
I'm not saying it's not legit, but it's concerning.
Jane,
ReplyDeleteI was left with some questions after watching this show too. I am assuming his "damnation" would have been for mortal sins, right? It doesn't say on this clip but I could have sworn on the original show that he said it was serious sin that condemned him - this was after the testimony he gave but it's not on this clip. I was thinking that part of it was cut out, maybe?
I think it changed him greatly. He became an intercessor for others whereas before he said his only concern was for himself and what his peers thought of him.
Thanks for the link! I'll go check out the story...you've got me curious.
Thanks, Mary. I went back and you're right, he does say he was in a state of mortal sin and didn't care about it.
ReplyDeleteI guess what I was waiting for was something more like, "Now when my parishioners call me at three in the morning to visit the dying, I don't grumble about it, I just see it as a way of being Christ to the ones who need Him..." etc etc. But I'm being picky here. He was vague about the "after" part and specific changes he made, but he does say he increased his prayer life.
Jane,
ReplyDeleteI just sent you an e-mail about the link you sent me. You can probably guess how it affected me. Thank you.
Wow, I hadn't seen this before. Very powerful. Felt something heavy in the middle of my chest while watching this. I knew exactly what she meant when she said, "I almost hate to go to calls." Here is a man who has appeared before the judgment seat of Christ, and experienced the loving intercession of the Blessed Mother. I wanted Mother Angelica to ask him more! I read the Gloria Polo (doesn't pollo mean Chicken?) testimony today too. It does make me wonder. The only thing anyone has is to be made clean in the Precious Blood of the Lamb. If we die in that knowledge and plead for his Divine Mercy, even if we are between good confessions and "valid" absolutions (due to firm purpose of amendment being present)wouldn't pleading for this be enough, or would it really require the pleading of Mary, and the pleading of others of her children and Christ's followers? Makes me wonder. Maybe it is Mary's pleading with her spouse the Holy Spirit that had all these Christians, whether Catholic or not, praying for this Father Scheier and for the peasant half-way across Colombia praying for Gloria. The Communion of Saints is real, and there is some power for sure in prayer. I remember Jesus telling St. Faustina to pray the chaplet after he took her to the bed of a dying sinner being beseiged by demons. He wanted to save the man, had the power to save him, but he needed her prayers too. What a mystery?
ReplyDeleteMother Angelica is such a wonder. How adept she was to pick up on the unspoken confusion that was apparent to her, but not to Fr. Scheier on why mortal sin might still be there on the soul even after frequenting Confession. Contrition can be imperfect...sorrow because of fear of punishment rather than because of the offense of having offended Our Lord and added to his pain in his Passion and death, but firm purpose of amendment needs to be there regardless of imperfect contrition. That definitely gives me pause. And she ended perfectly...you read your car's owners manual (at least some refer to it on occasion) study what sin is . . . what the 10 Commandments are . . . Too bad they couldn't have used some executive programming direction to extend this episode another hour. She was on a roll.
Just watched this, thanks for posting!
ReplyDeleteI'd like to contact Fr. Sheier, just to send an email of thanks and a self-testimony. if anyone knows his email I'd be thankful.
ReplyDelete